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#1 June 20, 2010 19:21:53

Ilia A.
Registered: 2009-11-02
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[PHP-DEV] APC in trunk


I for one think it is a really good idea, there is no compelling
reason not to include APC, I would even go as far as say we should
enable it by default.

+1

On Sat, Jun 19, 2010 at 9:23 AM, Kalle Sommer Nielsen <ka***@*hp.net> wrote:
> Greetings
>
> As the process for trunk grows, I think we should consider which
> extensions we will move in and out of the core, this thread however is
> solely about moving APC into the core.
>
> As original proposed and agreed on the PDM in Paris, was to include
> APC in PHP6, and not turn it on by default. I think it will benefit
> both us and the community if we move APC into the core (trunk, 5.4).
> APC is one of the most popular extensions at PECL and many core devs
> also work on APC.
>
> Currently the only issue I see by putting APC into the core is the CS,
> as APC uses spaces instead of tabs.
>
> Another thing we might want to look at is whether we should support
> 5.2, or simply upgrade APC's version and break backwards compatibility
> so we don't have a layer of checks for macros that wasn't available in
> previous version, perhaps only require 5.3+ within the APC code, this
> however is not really a question of including APC in the core, but
> rather a per extension discussion ;-)
>
> What are your views on including APC in the core, or reasons not to?
>
> --
> regards,
>
> Kalle Sommer Nielsen
> ka***@*hp.net
>
> --
> PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List
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>

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#2 June 20, 2010 21:22:17

Lester C.
Registered: 2009-11-02
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[PHP-DEV] APC in trunk


( Foregot to change address again :( )
Ilia Alshanetsky wrote:What are your views on including APC in the core, or reasons not to?Dictatorship?Optional module which have well used alternatives should not be proced on bydefault! Probably more people use alternatives and have for years?--
Lester Caine - G8HFL
-----------------------------
Contact -http://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contactL.S.Caine Electronic Services -http://lsces.co.ukEnquirySolve -http://enquirysolve.com/Model Engineers Digital Workshop -http://medw.co.uk//Firebird -http://www.firebirdsql.org/index.php--
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#3 June 20, 2010 21:39:54

Lukas K.
Registered: 2009-11-02
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[PHP-DEV] APC in trunk


On 20.06.2010, at 22:21, Lester Caine wrote:

> ( Foregot to change address again :( )
> Ilia Alshanetsky wrote:
>> What are your views on including APC in the core, or reasons not to?
>
> Dictatorship?
> Optional module which have well used alternatives should not be proced on by
> default! Probably more people use alternatives and have for years?


probably not actually .. my guess is that the vast majority of users do not use
any byte code cache today. this could be our effort to reduce co2 emissions
world wide.

+1 on adding apc to trunk
+0 about enabling apc by default .. or rather undecided at this point.

regards,
Lukas Kahwe Smith
m...@pooteeweet.org




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#4 June 20, 2010 21:42:31

John C.
Registered: 2009-11-02
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[PHP-DEV] APC in trunk


+1 as Lukas, on adding but not enabled by default.



On Jun 20, 2010, at 4:39 PM, Lukas Kahwe Smith <m***@*ooteeweet.org> wrote:

>
> On 20.06.2010, at 22:21, Lester Caine wrote:
>
>> ( Foregot to change address again :( )
>> Ilia Alshanetsky wrote:
>>> What are your views on including APC in the core, or reasons not to?
>>
>> Dictatorship?
>> Optional module which have well used alternatives should not be proced on by
>> default! Probably more people use alternatives and have for years?
>
>
> probably not actually .. my guess is that the vast majority of users do not
> use any byte code cache today. this could be our effort to reduce co2
> emissions world wide.
>
> +1 on adding apc to trunk
> +0 about enabling apc by default .. or rather undecided at this point.
>
> regards,
> Lukas Kahwe Smith
> m***@*ooteeweet.org
>
>
>
>
> --
> PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List
> To unsubscribe, visit:http://www.php.net/unsub.php>

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#5 June 20, 2010 21:46:19

Rasmus L.
Registered: 2009-11-02
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[PHP-DEV] APC in trunk


On 6/20/10 1:21 PM, Lester Caine wrote:
> ( Foregot to change address again :( )
> Ilia Alshanetsky wrote:
>> What are your views on including APC in the core, or reasons not to?
>
> Dictatorship?
> Optional module which have well used alternatives should not be proced
> on by default! Probably more people use alternatives and have for years?

pecl has been around for years. Nobody else has submitted an opcode
cache to pecl. We certainly would not have rejected any such
submission, and we still won't.

-Rasmus

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#6 June 20, 2010 21:54:40

Derick R.
Registered: 2009-11-02
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[PHP-DEV] APC in trunk


On Sun, 20 Jun 2010, Rasmus Lerdorf wrote:

> On 6/20/10 1:21 PM, Lester Caine wrote:
> > ( Foregot to change address again :( )
> > Ilia Alshanetsky wrote:
> >> What are your views on including APC in the core, or reasons not to?
> >
> > Dictatorship?
> > Optional module which have well used alternatives should not be proced
> > on by default! Probably more people use alternatives and have for years?
>
> pecl has been around for years. Nobody else has submitted an opcode
> cache to pecl. We certainly would not have rejected any such
> submission, and we still won't.

Actually, there is another one: wincache.

Derick

--http://derickrethans.nl|http://xdebug.orgLike Xdebug? Consider a donation:http://xdebug.org/donate.phptwitter: @derickr and @xdebug

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#7 June 20, 2010 21:57:13

Ferenc K.
Registered: 2009-11-02
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[PHP-DEV] APC in trunk


On Sun, Jun 20, 2010 at 10:39 PM, Lukas Kahwe Smith <m***@*ooteeweet.org>wrote:

>
> On 20.06.2010, at 22:21, Lester Caine wrote:
>
> > ( Foregot to change address again :( )
> > Ilia Alshanetsky wrote:
> >> What are your views on including APC in the core, or reasons not to?
> >
> > Dictatorship?
> > Optional module which have well used alternatives should not be proced on
> by default! Probably more people use alternatives and have for years?
>
>
> probably not actually .. my guess is that the vast majority of users do not
> use any byte code cache today. this could be our effort to reduce co2
> emissions world wide.
>

Are you sure?
Usually installing an opcode cache is the first optimalization effort for
every php project.
I'ts easy, it's transparent, and can give a vast amount of performance
boost, so
- shared hosting providers install it, because they can oversell more
- ppl who can run dedicated server/vps usually knowledgeable enough to
install it right away



>
> +1 on adding apc to trunk
> +0 about enabling apc by default .. or rather undecided at this point.
>
>
I prefer xcache, but I think that its better adding apc to the core, than
nothing at all.
Why should this be disabled by default?

I never had any problem using xcache. Maybe that it has no gain if you only
use php for cli or cgi.

Tyrael

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#8 June 20, 2010 22:00:54

Derick R.
Registered: 2009-11-02
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[PHP-DEV] APC in trunk


On Sun, 20 Jun 2010, Ilia Alshanetsky wrote:

> I for one think it is a really good idea, there is no compelling
> reason not to include APC, I would even go as far as say we should
> enable it by default.

I would like to add it as well; but not turn it on by default. Not
because it wouldn't be good, but more because it requires (a bit of)
configuration.

Derick

--http://derickrethans.nl|http://xdebug.orgLike Xdebug? Consider a donation:http://xdebug.org/donate.phptwitter: @derickr and @xdebug

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#9 June 20, 2010 22:05:56

Lester C.
Registered: 2009-11-02
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[PHP-DEV] APC in trunk


Rasmus Lerdorf wrote:On 6/20/10 1:21 PM, Lester Caine wrote:( Foregot to change address again :( )
Ilia Alshanetsky wrote:What are your views on including APC in the core, or reasons not to?Dictatorship?
Optional module which have well used alternatives should not be proced
on by default! Probably more people use alternatives and have for years?pecl has been around for years. Nobody else has submitted an opcode
cache to pecl. We certainly would not have rejected any such
submission, and we still won't.Well eaccelerator has served me well for years on both Windows and Linux and hasbeen listed on wikipedia for years before APC was added ;) Just because peopledon't like restrictive source management does not mean good code is not available.--
Lester Caine - G8HFL
-----------------------------
Contact -http://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contactL.S.Caine Electronic Services -http://lsces.co.ukEnquirySolve -http://enquirysolve.com/Model Engineers Digital Workshop -http://medw.co.uk//Firebird -http://www.firebirdsql.org/index.php--
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#10 June 20, 2010 22:06:38

Michael S.
Registered: 2009-11-02
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[PHP-DEV] APC in trunk


Perhaps by adding it to core the original reasons for alternatives will be
reduced and the things that make those special could be implemented into apc?

On Jun 20, 2010, at 1:56 PM, Ferenc Kovacs <i***@*yrael.hu> wrote:

> On Sun, Jun 20, 2010 at 10:39 PM, Lukas Kahwe Smith
> <m***@*ooteeweet.org>wrote:
>
>>
>> On 20.06.2010, at 22:21, Lester Caine wrote:
>>
>>> ( Foregot to change address again :( )
>>> Ilia Alshanetsky wrote:
>>>> What are your views on including APC in the core, or reasons not to?
>>>
>>> Dictatorship?
>>> Optional module which have well used alternatives should not be proced on
>> by default! Probably more people use alternatives and have for years?
>>
>>
>> probably not actually .. my guess is that the vast majority of users do not
>> use any byte code cache today. this could be our effort to reduce co2
>> emissions world wide.
>>
>
> Are you sure?
> Usually installing an opcode cache is the first optimalization effort for
> every php project.
> I'ts easy, it's transparent, and can give a vast amount of performance
> boost, so
> - shared hosting providers install it, because they can oversell more
> - ppl who can run dedicated server/vps usually knowledgeable enough to
> install it right away
>
>
>
>>
>> +1 on adding apc to trunk
>> +0 about enabling apc by default .. or rather undecided at this point.
>>
>>
> I prefer xcache, but I think that its better adding apc to the core, than
> nothing at all.
> Why should this be disabled by default?
>
> I never had any problem using xcache. Maybe that it has no gain if you only
> use php for cli or cgi.
>
> Tyrael

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