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#1 June 14, 2010 19:35:49

H.
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Seeking Django vs. Joomla comparison


Hello Django users,

I have a question. Do you know any reference, link or white paper that
compares Joomla to Django? I know how wrong this comparison could be,
but an avid Joomla/PHP vendor is making it.

Also, if you know a reference material to compare Django to PHP, that
would be nice too, although even this one might not come across as an
apple-to-apple comparison.

Please reply here or e-mail me directly. My e-mail address is
hfn1...@yahoo.com

Thank you..

Hoosh

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#2 June 15, 2010 02:18:38

Kenneth G.
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Seeking Django vs. Joomla comparison


On Tuesday 15 June 2010 00:05:44 Hooshyar wrote:
> I have a question. Do you know any reference, link or white paper that
> compares Joomla to Django? I know how wrong this comparison could be,
> but an avid Joomla/PHP vendor is making it.

django is a framework, joomla is a cms - so they cannot be compared. You
should look to comparing django to something like cakephp
>
> Also, if you know a reference material to compare Django to PHP, that
> would be nice too, although even this one might not come across as an
> apple-to-apple comparison.
>
django is a framework, php is a scripting language - you should look to
compare php with python.

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Kenneth Gonsalves
Senior Associate
NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

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#3 June 15, 2010 11:50:12

justin j.
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Seeking Django vs. Joomla comparison


The previous author is right Django is a framework to build systems
and not an already built system like a Content Management System, like
Joomla. If you do want a comparison you have to compare a Django built
CMS like :http://www.django-cms.org/.

I don't know the reasons for your comparison but having used most
popular CMS systems: Wordpress, Joomla and Concrete 5:http://www.concrete5.org/I can tell you that Concrete 5 is the easiest and quickest to setup
for the user and developer. In comparison Joomla is a headache, a
messy and hard to learn system. Just check out concrete 5 demo to see
why:http://www.concrete5.org/You should only really consider using Django CMS (although a very good
system) if you need to add custom apps and custom functionality that
you cannot find with a system like Concrete5 and you should also have
a good grounding in Django/Python to start with in order to set the
system up and seeing as you are asking this question I assume you have
not.

I am not a salesman, I have just tried many other CMS systems and
concrete5 will make you smile at its ease of use and quick build
time :)

A comparison here Joomla/Drupal and C5:http://www.cmswire.com/cms/web-cms/drupal-and-joomla-to-lose-market-share-to-concrete5-web-cms-004347.phpHope this helps you.


On Jun 15, 2:19 am, Kenneth Gonsalves <law...@au-kbc.org> wrote:
> On Tuesday 15 June 2010 00:05:44 Hooshyar wrote:
>
> > I have a question. Do you know any reference, link or white paper that
> > compares Joomla to Django? I know how wrong this comparison could be,
> > but an avid Joomla/PHP vendor is making it.
>
> django is a framework, joomla is a cms - so they cannot be compared. You
> should look to comparing django to something like cakephp
>
> > Also, if you know a reference material to compare Django to PHP, that
> > would be nice too, although even this one might not come across as an
> > apple-to-apple comparison.
>
> django is a framework, php is a scripting language - you should look to
> compare php with python.
>
> --
> Regards
> Kenneth Gonsalves
> Senior Associate
> NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

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#4 June 15, 2010 11:50:53

justin j.
Registered: 2009-11-02
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Seeking Django vs. Joomla comparison


The previous author is right Django is a framework to build systems
and not an already built system like a Content Management System, like
Joomla. If you do want a comparison you have to compare a Django built
CMS like :http://www.django-cms.org/.

I don't know the reasons for your comparison but having used most
popular CMS systems: Wordpress, Joomla and Concrete 5:http://www.concrete5.org/I can tell you that Concrete 5 is the easiest and quickest to setup
for the user and developer. In comparison Joomla is a headache, a
messy and hard to learn system. Just check out concrete 5 demo to see
why:http://www.concrete5.org/You should only really consider using Django CMS (although a very good
system) if you need to add custom apps and custom functionality that
you cannot find with a system like Concrete5 and you should also have
a good grounding in Django/Python to start with in order to set the
system up and seeing as you are asking this question I assume you have
not.

I am not a salesman, I have just tried many other CMS systems and
concrete5 will make you smile at its ease of use and quick build
time :)

A comparison here Joomla/Drupal and C5:http://www.cmswire.com/cms/web-cms/drupal-and-joomla-to-lose-market-share-to-concrete5-web-cms-004347.phpHope this helps you.


On Jun 15, 2:19 am, Kenneth Gonsalves <law...@au-kbc.org> wrote:
> On Tuesday 15 June 2010 00:05:44 Hooshyar wrote:
>
> > I have a question. Do you know any reference, link or white paper that
> > compares Joomla to Django? I know how wrong this comparison could be,
> > but an avid Joomla/PHP vendor is making it.
>
> django is a framework, joomla is a cms - so they cannot be compared. You
> should look to comparing django to something like cakephp
>
> > Also, if you know a reference material to compare Django to PHP, that
> > would be nice too, although even this one might not come across as an
> > apple-to-apple comparison.
>
> django is a framework, php is a scripting language - you should look to
> compare php with python.
>
> --
> Regards
> Kenneth Gonsalves
> Senior Associate
> NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

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#5 June 15, 2010 17:12:01

s.
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Seeking Django vs. Joomla comparison


On Jun 15, 3:50 am, justin jools <justinjo...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> The previous author is right Django is a framework to build systems
> and not an already built system like a Content Management System, like
> Joomla. If you do want a comparison you have to compare a Django built
> CMS like :http://www.django-cms.org/.

This is the usual answer - that they can't be compared because
they're apples and oranges. I don't buy it. Yes, one is a framework
and the other is a CMS. But from the position of an organization
trying to decide between a framework and a CMS, the comparisons are
valuable and necessary. In addition, because of Django's free "admin"
feature, Django is really a framework that comes bundled with a CMS.
Not to mention the fact that many CMSs have framework-like
characteristics "Django is a framework with CMS tendencies; Drupal is
a CMS with framework tendencies." It's not as apples/oranges as many
people claim it is.

These comparisons are not only possible, they're essential for a boss
or a company trying to decide on their next platform. Only us geeks
say things like "They can't be compared." Of course they can.

I don't have a Joomla comparison, but I did put together this
comparison with Drupal:http://birdhouse.org/blog/2009/11/11/drupal-or-django/Scot

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#6 June 15, 2010 19:46:27

Torsten B.
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Seeking Django vs. Joomla comparison


Hallöchen!

shacker writes:

>
>
> These comparisons are not only possible, they're essential for a
> boss or a company trying to decide on their next platform. Only us
> geeks say things like "They can't be compared." Of course they
> can.

Well, somewhat.

First you need a functional specification for your project,
i.e. "must have"'s and "nice to have"'s. Size and agility of the
community as well as documentation are important, too. Then you can
filter a little bit. But most established frameworks/CMSes will
still fit the bill.

The primary filter must be the language anyway. The people who are
supposed to work on it must feel comfortable with it. If they do,
they'll work as efficient with any mature tool.

But you can't compare further technical things like "this ORM layer
may be better" or "that wiki-in-5-minutes screencast is more
impressive". The worst thing are benchmarks. Never look at them.

Tschö,
Torsten.

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#7 June 15, 2010 21:07:08

s.
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Seeking Django vs. Joomla comparison


On Jun 15, 11:43 am, Torsten Bronger <bron...@physik.rwth-aachen.de>
wrote:

> First you need a functional specification for your project,
> i.e. "must have"'s and "nice to have"'s.  Size and agility of the
> community as well as documentation are important, too.  Then you can
> filter a little bit.  But most established frameworks/CMSes will
> still fit the bill.

It depends what your "zoom level" is. For example, the org's questions
may be questions like:

- In which system can we get our site up the fastest?
- Which system will be the most flexible if we need to go in new
directions?
- In which system will it be easiest to find qualified developers?
- In which system can I mix and match data models to our heart's
content?
- Which system has the most mature 3rd-party plugins/modules/apps?
- Which system's templates are easiest to work with?
- Which system will make it easiest to convert our existing data into?
- How easy is it to create custom workflows?

These are real-world questions that apply equally to frameworks and
CMSs.


> The primary filter must be the language anyway.  The people who are

The counter-argument is that languages are similar enough that
experienced / good developers can get up to speed pretty quickly even
if you change languages. In other words I'd rather work with an
experienced/good developer even if it means they have to learn a new
language than to work with a less-experienced developer for whom
learning a new language is a deal-breaker.

My .02

./s

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#8 June 16, 2010 00:18:50

Kenneth G.
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Seeking Django vs. Joomla comparison


On Tuesday 15 June 2010 21:41:56 shacker wrote:
> These comparisons are not only possible, they're essential for a boss
> or a company trying to decide on their next platform. Only us geeks
> say things like "They can't be compared." Of course they can.
>

in which case compare drupal/joomla with plone. Plone will win hands down.
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Kenneth Gonsalves
Senior Associate
NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

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#9 June 16, 2010 00:37:12

Kenneth G.
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Seeking Django vs. Joomla comparison


On Wednesday 16 June 2010 01:37:02 shacker wrote:
> It depends what your "zoom level" is. For example, the org's questions
> may be questions like:
>

if it is drupal/joomla vs plone

> - In which system can we get our site up the fastest?

plone
> - Which system will be the most flexible if we need to go in new
> directions?

plone
> - In which system will it be easiest to find qualified developers?

drupal/joomla (depending on the definition of qualified)
> - In which system can I mix and match data models to our heart's
> content?

plone
> - Which system has the most mature 3rd-party plugins/modules/apps?

plone
> - Which system's templates are easiest to work with?

drupal/joomla
> - Which system will make it easiest to convert our existing data into?

depends on your existing data - if it is in a RDBMS then drupal/joomla -
otherwise a toss-up (one can use an RDBMS with plone)
> - How easy is it to create custom workflows?
>
plone has several out of the box

and one question you forgot

which system has regular security patches (at least twice a month)?

drupal/joomla - since security patches are rare to non-existent in plone,
suits may not feel comfortable with it.

--
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Kenneth Gonsalves
Senior Associate
NRC-FOSS at AU-KBC

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#10 June 16, 2010 06:56:26

Torsten B.
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Seeking Django vs. Joomla comparison


Hallöchen!

shacker writes:

> On Jun 15, 11:43 am, Torsten Bronger <bron...@physik.rwth-aachen.de>
> wrote:
>
>> First you need a functional specification for your project,
>> i.e. "must have"'s and "nice to have"'s.  Size and agility of the
>> community as well as documentation are important, too.  Then you
>> can filter a little bit.  But most established frameworks/CMSes
>> will still fit the bill.
>
> It depends what your "zoom level" is. For example, the org's
> questions may be questions like:
>
> - In which system can we get our site up the fastest?
> - Which system will be the most flexible if we need to go in new
> directions?
> - In which system will it be easiest to find qualified developers?
> - In which system can I mix and match data models to our heart's
> content?
> - Which system has the most mature 3rd-party plugins/modules/apps?
> - Which system's templates are easiest to work with?
> - Which system will make it easiest to convert our existing data into?
> - How easy is it to create custom workflows?
>
> These are real-world questions that apply equally to frameworks
> and CMSs.

Absolutely, yes. But nobody will be able to give you answers to
these, even if they claim they are. Take the template system (TS)
as an example: Fans of TS 1 will say that TS 2 is over-complicated
and hard to maintain. But fans of TS 2 will code faster in it than
in TS 1. We are talking about mature systems only, so you can code
efficiently in any of them if you abandon prejudices and fears of
contacts.

>> The primary filter must be the language anyway.  The people who
>> are
>
> The counter-argument is that languages are similar enough that
> experienced / good developers can get up to speed pretty quickly
> even if you change languages. In other words I'd rather work with
> an experienced/good developer even if it means they have to learn
> a new language than to work with a less-experienced developer for
> whom learning a new language is a deal-breaker.

In my experience it takes a long time before you master a language
so that you can write maintainable code in it. It's a lot more than
just writing working code. You must know the idioms and anti-idioms
that the language's community has acquired over the years. And you
must know the libraries, which are huge for today's languages.

I'd never choose Scala for example, because you don't get developers
with Scala experience. It may be a great language, but I'd prefer
Python/Java/C#/Ruby/PHP and pick from a lot of applicants with
experience in them. (Even Python was not so simple in our case, by
the way.)

Tschö,
Torsten.

--
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orhttp://bronger-jmp.appspot.com--
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